Author Topic: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus  (Read 15776 times)

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Offline maxsmom

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #30 on: June 25, 2013, 11:42:09 PM »
Agree...when tail spread and head fluffed back away and give Max space.....quite normal and nice to have this clear communication from them
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Offline Louise9460

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #31 on: June 26, 2013, 10:52:43 AM »
Thank you so much for your replies, Dartman and Momazon. :) I am so happy that he is finally starting to communicate with me - even if he is just saying "back off, you, this is my cage".  :biglaughing:

Does it mean that he actually is a male? Or would a female do the same?

As for touching I have not even tried that yet. Usually I just sit on a chair next to his cage and read or stand by the cage babytalking, whistling or singing to him as he seems to like that. He always comes close to the bars and looks curious and interested when I do that and sometimes he "twitters" along. Also he has compleately stopped looking alarmed when I try to communicate with him as well as he hardly ever hyperventilates anymore. So I feel that we are making progress but I don't want to push him.

I didn't do that with my old rescue lorikeet either and one day he just climbed onto my arm by himself. I want Max to be able to make the same choice if he wants to. If not it is okay. Then I am perfectly satisfied with just communicating with him and watching his funny behavior when he clows around in his cage. I really wish I could let him out of the cage... but I don't feel certain enough yet that I will be able to get him back in. So that'll have to wait just a bit longer.

Offline Dartman

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #32 on: June 26, 2013, 08:44:40 PM »
I think they all do it though Lurch is a DNA male according to the previous owner, and don't know about Nerd but pretty positive he was male too. Lurch slowly got closer and closer and eventually started hanging out on the chair next to me, then on my chair, then down on the arm to get scritches. Now he flies over and lands on our shoulders to watch what we're doing and steal food and scritches, though if we don't get with his treats he pops us in the neck so we're careful about doing anything food related whiles he's up there. Your guy will do similar I'm sure on his schedule when he's ready and you'll truly earn his trust and love that way and have a friend for life.
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Offline Louise9460

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #33 on: June 27, 2013, 01:50:56 AM »
A quick question: From what I have learned Max can't fly. I doubt that he has ever learned how.

Let's just say that I try to open his cage while he is still not tame or completely trusting... Would that be a bad idea in case he decides to come out and take a look on life outside the cage? I'm thinking that he might fall down and get hurt or that I might have to pick him up with my hands which will definetely scare him to get him back into his cage?

I want him to learn how to explore the world outside of his cage but don't want him to get hurt og scared... and I've never had any experiences with parrots that both couldn't fly and weren't tame.

Offline Jan

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #34 on: June 27, 2013, 10:26:38 AM »

Does Max have all his full flight feathers grown in or is he clipped?  If he is fully flighted and even though he may not be use to flying and he comes out, should he get scared and/or startled then he could take flight.  Can you handle him at all? If he is not use to your hands then at some point you need to start training him to step up and it is always a very good idea to "stick train" a bird as well for those times you can not get him to get on your hand or should he be too nippy.
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Offline Louise9460

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #35 on: June 27, 2013, 02:31:49 PM »
The problem with Max is that he is not used to being handled at all. Not by me or not by anyone else. He is a rescue who spent the first 14 years of his life locked in a cage of 45 x 45 x 80 cm and never came out. He was fed, of course, but never handled in any way. I have now had him for a little over a month and it is not until recently he has felt comfortable enough and gained enough trust to just start showing a bit of interest in me and communicate with me. The first couple of weeks he would get terrified and start hyperventilating as soon as we got too close to the cage.

Then I decided that he had been here long enough to be moved into a new, larger, and better cage. At first he was really scared but even though he still shows stereotypical behaviour every once in a while he has definetely become more extrovert and seems a lot happier than he did before starting to show a few signs of playfulness which weren't there before.

However, if I put my hand too close for his liking he either threatens to bite me by blowing up his feathers, lifting his wings, hissing, and snapping into the air close to my fingers or simply just gets scared and tumbles to the opposite side of the cage.

As for his feathers I don't think they are clipped but he has plucked himself a little bit so I am not entirely sure if his flight feathers are intact. His chest muscles are underdeveloped though due to the lack of possibilites to fly.

Offline Cetan

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #36 on: July 09, 2013, 09:09:53 AM »
My Adam was a breeder who was not handled and said to be aggressive - what I did is I would leave his cage door open when I was home and it took a while but eventually he started to come out and sit on top, at first just a few minutes then he would go back in on his own. I put a bunch of foot toys up there sand he has realized that is part of his space and will come in and out as he wants. I know that he loves his Nutriberries so I can always lure him back in his house if I have to go to work.

Offline momazon

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #37 on: July 09, 2013, 12:25:28 PM »
Do you think these babies will ever be able to be handled?  would handing them food help?  You have probably both already tried everything.  You are right not to push them, it must be terrifying to have a human come so close after so long.

Offline maxsmom

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #38 on: July 09, 2013, 06:36:14 PM »
So wonderful to hear of big cage you have  provided.Your posts describe the eqivalent of a prisoner being shown freedom.  I look forward to hearing more developments.

I have a 9 year old pionus I adopted 8 months ago. I have a feeling his previous conditions were not ideal due to his eating habits but he had a better environment than your pi had before coming to you. My pi did experienxe a lot of instability though it seems. Anyway this is to say he is still opening up and getting used to his new home. I lowered expectations and I take it very slowly. Life is on his terms. And I clearly see that he is happy.  So just give it a lot of time....they are individuals.
.sensitive ones at that
She flies with her own wings. Oregon State Motto

Offline Louise9460

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #39 on: July 17, 2013, 09:30:44 AM »
Over the past few weeks, unfortunately Max' aggression and territorial behavior has increased. Now I really have to watch my fingers when I feed him etc. and he has already bit me twice. Sometimes my passing his cage is enough to make him angry and I have absolutely no idea what I've done wrong.

I know that the people who brought him to me told me that he was aggressive but up untill a couple of weeks ago I didn't see much of that. It started out with the behavior I've asked about earlier and then one day he just attacked my hand and bit me when I reached for his food bowl to re-fill it.

So far I try to teach him that my hand in his cage is a good thing by always having a treat ready for him when I reach inside it. I am hoping that will ease his aggression in time... I must admit, though, that I have never had any experience with that much aggression before.

Offline E

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #40 on: July 17, 2013, 12:00:14 PM »
Cage and food aggressive is ordinarily. And the cage is his so he have all the right to protect it in my opinion.
Just keep talking to him and hold a distance. I think he is telling you to back off. I don't think he is aggressive (more then to protect what is his) so this behavior will go away if you have patience and back off when he gets angry.

   

Offline Dartman

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #41 on: July 17, 2013, 06:41:35 PM »
Yep, It's part of what they do, in fact most birds are protective of their house, even our rescued House Finch would put up a good battle if I put a finger in her cage. Had Nerd for 31 years and he always defended his house and claimed space so we mostly respected his boundaries and got along fine with the occasional pinch or lightnip if we went too far. Nerd eventually tolerated me reaching into his house but he never liked it, he just trusted me enough to allow it.
Don't feelbad and just adapt, eventually he may be a bit more forgiving when he decides your a flock mate and trustworthy.
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Offline Louise9460

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #42 on: July 18, 2013, 01:32:56 AM »
Thank you for your encouraging words. I must admit that I feared Max' aggression was mainly due to his unfortunate past and I suspect it is as strong as it is because he had managed to scare off his former owner who was an elderly lady. Actually I have made a big deal out of not backing off when he starts acting up because I wanted to show him that he could not scare me off... but perhaps that has been the wrong approach?

I do try to give him some space, though, when I am not feeding him or giving fresh water in an attempt not to provoke his aggression.

Is it really normal that a parrot gets so angry every time I just pass his cage? It's just that I've never experienced that before but on the other hand all the other parrots I've dealt with have been tame and used to being handled. So a parrot like Max is a new experience to me.

I really hope, though, that you are right and that he will become less aggressive and more trusting in the future. :)

Offline maxsmom

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #43 on: July 18, 2013, 06:25:55 PM »
Yes it really is. I agree with Eloy. Your pi most likely is giving you advance warning. It takes time to learn to read them but pi give a lot of body language warning. My pi rattles a metal bowl and then throws it if I come near his cage when he doesn't want me to. Good Bird Inc has a dvd on reading bird body language...highly recommend it.

Where is cage placed? Against wall? In a corner? Your pi needs an area in cage where it feels safe because no predator can come from behind.

Be really really patient. It takes a lot of time to settle some birds. I know through experience it is easier to say than experience. :-)
She flies with her own wings. Oregon State Motto

Offline Cetan

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Re: The rescue Amazon who turned out to be a Pionus
« Reply #44 on: July 22, 2013, 06:43:24 PM »
Also this seems to be the time of year they get hormonal and with male Pis hormones = aggression. Adam has snapped at me for no real reason a few times so dont feel bad, just give him a little time and space.